Dale Innis describes the Redzone issue as silly, not just people’s concerns about Redzone, Dale is talking about Redzone itself being silly because it can’t possibly be accurate. Hamlet over at New World Notes suggests it’s not a big issue because so few of Second Life’s total population have voted on the Jira. They are both right to a degree but are both missing the bigger issues because this isn’t about IP logging or tracking, I get to see IP addresses of visitors here, it’s not what gets logged that’s the issue, it’s how it’s used.
Data is required to help improve services, but that data should really be limited when it’s going to be shared or used for marketing purposes, I used to work with a guy who would spell his name incorrectly during surveys so he could track who was selling on his details. People get miffed when their data is used for purposes other than they expected, anyone commenting on my blog, or Hamlet’s isn’t giving us permission to put them on mailing lists, publish their details or engage in a marketing campaign with them and although some sites will try to do this, there are privacy laws and directives to be aware of, the issue is really one of respect, and that’s where Redzone and its users fall down.
The Redzone forums have been a hive of extremely dodgy suggestions since the community standards were changed, seeking ways to gain auto consent, which is just plain wrong and shows a distinct lack of respect, others have suggested that Redzone users are hiding their devices to try and avoid people being aware of their existence, if the device is so ethical why would you want to hide it?
The fact remains that people put on streaming media in Second Life, to listen to or view streaming media, that’s what they should expect, they shouldn’t expect that someone will be scanning them and entering them into a database that links their SL name with an IP address unless they are explicitly told this is happening and they consent to it, I don’t know why this is so difficult for Redzone users to grasp, they are asking to store and share information that is not listed in our profiles and they are looking to share that information. When you’re using or storing data, it should be fit for purpose, an IP address to stream media is fit for purpose, but I don’t need to know whose IP address it is, just that that IP address wants to listen to my stream.
There are concerns about data scraping full stop of course, some of this is over the top, I don’t personally object to people knowing I visited their parcel via a visitor logger and if they want to store how long I stayed for, I don’t see an issue with that, I was on their parcel, I was there for x amount of minutes, that did happen, but they shouldn’t be logging an IP address with that information and then sharing that information, because that’s really not the deal, nor should they be selling a scripted device that lets others view that information.
Data is a very serious business, people earn good money analysing it, looking for ways to use that data ethically is fine, looking for ways to circumvent the spirit of community standards, that’s really not fine. ZFire needs to grow up, make his product appealing to his customers without looking to circumvent the community standards and he should be able to do this without lowering himself to the sort of comments people have cited, such as trying to say that sixty seconds without response equals consent, it does not equal consent and ZFire knows this. I don’t care if sixty seconds of no response ends with a TP home or off the parcel, consent should be explicit. The other issue of course is whether it will be ZFire who gets in trouble for auto consent devices or the Redzone users that employ them.
However the main issue remains, people have an expectancy, rightly or wrongly, that their information won’t be used the way Redzone uses it, really, Redzone is exploiting a requirment to share your IP address to listen to media and it does so without even offering you a good tune! ZFire should rethink how he does this and work towards an ethical solution because right now people are losing sympathy with stores and sim owners over griefing and copybotting because of this device and we’re getting away from making copybotting and griefing big issues that deserve better solutions.
The best thing about the Redzone kerfuffle has been that we now have a lot more people who are aware of what gets shared via streaming media, what gets logged on blogs and that people can potentially abuse the information they receive.
On a side note I wonder, after Ann OToole brought it up over at SL Universe, whether LL could use a proxy server for streams that masks user IP addresses or whether LL can do deals with radio stations to broadcast inside Second Life, there may or may not be potential there, but having an LL certified stream would give people a bit more faith, even though exploits could very well still exist.
“others have suggested that Redzone users are hiding their devices to try and avoid people being aware of their existence, if the device is so ethical why would you want to hide it?”
not a suggestion, love. A fact.
zFire himself provided instructions on the RZ forums on removing his scripts from his own device and dropping them into a user’s own prim. This was initially done to try and prevent earlier versions of GreenZone detecting the *device*, rather than listening for calls from it (one of the problems being with early GZ HUDs is that they reported on *any* object bearing his details as Creator).
GZ was subsequently updated to avoid doing this (looking for an object Creator association). However, the fact that he’s willing to encourage his users to try and hide the devices does speak volumes.
I see you’re spelling Lord wrongly still, it’s Lord, not Love!
I’m trying to be fair to redzone users, it’s difficult obviously, but if they think there’s nothing wrong with their device and only copybotters and griefers oppose it, they should have no objection to people knowing it’s in use on their parcels, it does indeed speak volumes that they won’t embrace this concept.
There is being fair to RedZone users, and openly stating what the Creator himself has been advising.
I agree with your point on having nothing to hide – hence why I joined (dare I say…copied?) your RZ Challenge. As with any “security” device, there really is no reason to hide or otherwise disguise it. That people do so suggests they are more interested in its “voyeuristic/snooping” capabilities than they are with the security of their own stores / clubs / homes.